Culture Bridge: Converting In-Gallery Experiences Into Online Teacher Resources

Using the BMA's eLearning platform Culture Bridge, we will demonstrate how converting pre-existing in-gallery digital interactives into online teacher resources is a game-changer for not only museums with a small budget, but also for educators trying to bridge the widening gap between the classroom and reduced tour offerings. The session will begin with an overview and then move to a Q&A guided by polls. Track:Interpretation & Storytelling & Education


Unknown Speaker 19:12
So I'm Angela May. I'm a white woman with brown here behind me, our books, and several works of art on the wall.

Unknown Speaker 19:21
I'm Sean Pathasema I'm Anna, European and Southeast Asian descent. The black here behind me, there are several works of art on the wall.

Unknown Speaker 19:30
And before we begin, we would just like to begin with the land acknowledgement and that the Birmingham Museum of Art is located on the traditional lands of the Muskogee Creek. So in this session, we covered the benefits of asynchronous digital resources, and we'll demonstrate how converting art and gallery digital interpretation into teacher resources is beneficial. So feel free to post questions and comments in the chat, and then at the end of the session, we'll have a poll and begin q&a So, the BMA we're just really excited about our recent launch of culture bridge elearning across Asia, which is our E learning platform. And although we did have to accelerate its release due to the pandemic, it has so far been a success. It provides a digital mix and match teaching units in games that connect multiple museum platforms. It also has Google Classroom integration, and then multiple resource types, videos, quizzes, quick guides art activities steam plans, digital puzzles Bitmoji classrooms and meditation studios and interactive images which we'll be focusing on today. But before we look at the website and discuss our tactics for in gallery interactive conversion. It is a good time to cover the five benefits of asynchronous digital resources that we've sort of discovered through culture bridge. So one, dependability, educators really need consistency for their classrooms and sometimes museums we like to switch things up and put things on or off view. So digital resources ensure that educators can use the same resources, year after a year in their lesson plans, and of course, not to mention that works can be removed from a gallery, but online the educator always has access to the object and its material, which also increases collection accessibility as well. So another benefit is confidence. Educators need to feel confident in the validity of the resource, as well as their ability to teach the material. So digital museum resources provide that 24 Seven, access to data, materials, and also digital resources are simply just a medium that young learners are familiar with, and they know expect to receive information this way. And bonus digital material is super easy to update as new scholarship or information changes, so you're not spending a lot of time or money reprinting something once new scholarship comes about. So number three is impact digital materials can be shared, beyond the institution's region, increasing the museum's reach and impact through analytics, we know culture bridges greatest impact is in our state, Alabama. But resources are being accessed in every US state except for North Dakota. What's up with that North Dakota to cool for culture branch, but also resources are being accessed across the globe. And that's really exciting to see how far your institution. Impact can reach, especially with culture bridge only being open for one year. Number four is the lore, so I know that there's this ongoing fear that the more you build online, the less people may visit your actual institution, but I think we've really all kind of come to the same idea that online material is an enticement. And it feels desire to finally see that specific object in person. And number five which is my favorite is boundless possibilities. So digital resources allow me some educators, and web teams to break free from the confines of the gallery and create an entirely new model for museum learning and engagement. So we're gonna look at some of these ways that we can create new models. So, interactive, we're going to get to our interactive conversion and we're going to look at some of our gallery interactive to talk about how we moved them to an asynchronous resource

Unknown Speaker 24:26
are in gallery digital interpretation and engagement. That's our smart guide, which you see right here, and that sort of digital guide through the galleries, and we also have smart good plus, which are interactive, images, and interactive storytelling. So they're designed to work in tandem with specific objects displayed in the galleries. So it is a self guided experience, but it's dependent on being, you know the visitor or early learner, being at the museum. But we found that these interactive experiences had value outside of the galleries that was especially when teachers said things like, sure wish I had this in my classroom. And is this available online. So we really knew we were on the right track and moving towards something that we think educators really needed. And so for us at the DNA creativity begins when you stop using something the way it was intended, and create something new. And before the conversion to asynchronous resources we were already experimenting with ways to evolve, digital engagement in the galleries, And that's like using the smart guide to turn the galleries, into a video game, where the galleries became the game landscape, the visitor became the player and the smart guy became the controller and this level of engagement alerted educators to non boring interpretation at the BMA. And what I mean by that is that we value providing multiple pathways to connecting to art. And so while some visitors want to learn more about a work, others are just looking for an experience where art plays a role, but is not being objective. Another experiment was using smart guide, plus for object repatriation. So, a couple of years ago, we repatriated our Shiva Linga back to India back to Tamil Nadu, and we made an interactive celebrating the absence of the object, and focusing on ethical museum practice by placing an interactive in front of the empty object nice so here we have the interactive, and it's standing before the nice where that object used to be exhibited. It is still one of our most touch, interactive, of all time. So even though this interactive is down, and we now have a new object in there and that's been a couple years, it's still one of our top interactive, letting us know, an actual art object, and a physical gallery is becoming less and less relevant. Oh and also, just to state that the more digital interpretation we build around repatriation, the more we normalize it and create an environment where the life of an object doesn't end once it leaves your gallery. I think that's important to note. So let's take a look at how interactive resources have evolved on our E Learning website culture bridge. Digital interpretation engagement can be really expensive. So we took those same principles of creativity, engagement, repurposing to incorporate technology that we were already using in our galleries, like the smart guide, like smart guide plus interactive, and we use that to enhance culture bridge, but also save some money at the same time. So it allowed educators to use interactive in the classroom, which we know was something that they wanted to do. It allowed educators to assign interactions as homework, and that's why we built the Google Classroom integration. And then also just enables educators and learners to take their time and practice slow looking techniques, since they're not having to compete for a good view in the galleries. So I'm gonna go ahead and navigate to the website to show a few interactive before we move over to polls and q&a, feel free to access the website via the QR code, and I'm about to link over right now.

Unknown Speaker 29:06
So hopefully everybody can see this on their screen. This is the culture bridge, landing page I'm going to go to our resource directory. And, you know, specific to today's talk, I'm going to go to our interactive images section, because we have a few different types of interactive, we have iconography focused interactive detailed imagery focused interactive, and then we have Bitmoji classrooms and meditation studios. I'm going to start with how to identify the Buddha to Buddha from Gandhara. And this interactive links to our Smart Guides so we're linking our two platforms. But this type of iconography focus interactive allow students to explore an image, and on non linear fashion. So touching on areas of interest the most about an object, I'm sure at this point we're all familiar with interactive images we've either encountered them or we have them at our own institution. We make our interactive in house. but for teachers, having different levels of interactives, helps them when they're making their own lesson plans, what they want to sign for homework. So, we used the functionality of the smart guide to host the interactive on culture bridge. So when you click on it it actually links to the smart guide platform to explore it. And that gives double the site visits, and if you're a nonprofit like we are, and it's a numbers game when it comes down to funding and metrics, the analytics you document from digital contribute to those grant proposals. So being able to link multiple platforms was something very beneficial for us. So I'm going to click on the tail again GT screens. This is a detailed focus, interactive, again I'm going to link over if you see at the bottom of the screen. We also have related resources so that you can build these mixed and matched teaching units on an object, and then this is our Google share classroom button. So it looks like over.

Unknown Speaker 31:25
And so these T screens are really really small, and they have illustrations from the chapters of the tale of kanji on the panels, but they're way way way too small to see in person. These screens are exhibited behind glass with really low lighting to protect the images. So, These interactive, not only provides the chapter titles and a brief synopsis of the chapter, but allows learners to see the illustrations, which you could never, ever, ever be able to see these details in the gallery, it just would not work. So this has been incredibly successful for us. And because educators, let us know that they were using these interactions in the galleries, that's why they asked for the Google Classroom share button, and that coding is free from Google so if you want to have your own integration, they provide the coding to do so. Very helpful. And so last before we move to q&a. I want to touch on our Bitmoji classrooms, they kind of combine multiple levels of what we are trying to accomplish by combining resources combining different platforms, and also matching, again let students started to learn during the pandemic. So, we saw MANY MANY educators creating Bitmoji classrooms during the Swift turnover during the pandemic. And we wanted to make some of our own Bitmoji rooms and classrooms and meditation studios to support local educators and to build on something that students were swiftly becoming familiar with. So, there are several benefits for Bitmoji or from Bitmoji classrooms. One is that they're built on Google Slides, which is really inexpensive and you can get any imagery that you need for free. So if budget is an issue. And then one of the best benefits of the Bitmoji rooms, is that you can recycle old interpretation, lesson plans articles that were made around an object, it really gives new life to interpretation that may have been removed. So in a Bitmoji classroom because it's interactive. If you click on the laptop, you're gonna go to a video specifically about, in this case Ganesh, with our five W's of art videos that are object centric videos designed for really K through sixth grade, but we found out that they're using them in college level classes as well. After the video, you can take a quiz, immediately on a work of art. And then below that we have in classroom activities that also work for distance learning. And these presentations are built on the platform, a teacher can use them to guide students, or they can be downloaded as worksheets and again we have related resources on the bottom. Always aligning that there are multiple ways that you can create a teaching unit around any single object in the collection. So again it just links to multiple resources by coloring outside the lines. If you go to the pinboard and click on it, it's actually going to lead back to our smart guide specifically to interpretation, that is built for in gallery use, and again it's just another way to get those multiple hits, get those multiple metrics, and through analytics we can gauge, who's using what, how much time we're using it, and then informs what we make for the next resources. And so, again, just multiple leaks. Links for Google classroom lesson plans, you name it. So Bitmoji has been an incredibly popular. We're in the middle of making more. And again, the platform is Google Sites and in the q&a we can discuss how we build out Google sites and other interactives, but I think timing wise, now that we're at 1213 It's been about a 15 minute presentation gonna kick it over to Shawn. Again, that's the end of this portion, these are emails, I'm going to pull this screen back up at the end of our q&a on closed session, but Shawn is going to take over for poles of start kind of gleaning what the audience is looking for. So Shawn let me know when you're ready to go to the first question and if we can launch the first

Unknown Speaker 36:11
poll as well.

Unknown Speaker 36:13
Yeah, we can go ahead and do the first question which is, is securing funding for digital education programs difficult at your institution, and it's a simple yes or no.

Unknown Speaker 36:31
And we'll give people some time.

Unknown Speaker 36:56
Looks like overwhelmingly, yes, which is not surprising considering museum budgets and everything. So now we can go to the second question, what budget range do your educational initiatives fall into. We have a 1000 to 10,000 be 10,000 to 50,000 See 50,000 to 100,000, the 100,000 to 300,000 and finally, 300,000 plus.

Unknown Speaker 37:50
All right, so we got a 5050 split between 1010 and 10,000 to 50,000. And on to Question three. What, if any types of gallery interpretation, do you employ at your institution. And you can choose as MANY as you'd like for this question so audio guide smartphone guide, small scale interactive major immersive, interactive experiences for none at all.

Unknown Speaker 38:54
This one's a little more varied looks like audio guides and small scale interactors are the top two categories. I would say this kind of lines up to where we came to these projects from one of the reasons why, smart guide and culture bridge are all web based. Really everything we do we try to keep built that way that way we can kind of port it from one platform to another.

Unknown Speaker 39:33
There was one question in the chat, can you link us to the platform's you used for these that was when Angie was talking about the Bitmoji classroom is that specifically. Jessica had asked this, what you were thinking of or were you asking of the platforms that we use so cultural bridge and smart guide.

Unknown Speaker 39:54
I was referring to the Bitmoji classroom because that's due to me, but I'm also interested in the other platforms that you're using. If there's API integration and and whatnot behind culture bridge itself.

Unknown Speaker 40:05
Okay. I'll start with our platforms. So culture bridge, we developed in house it's built on WordPress. So there, we don't have an API integration. We do have smart guide up as open source. It's on GitHub, we haven't updated that in a bit, because the chaos of the pandemic. But currently, yeah, there's really no way to kind of hook into what we've built. Otherwise,

Unknown Speaker 40:44
I can end the stock share, and then pull up the Google side platform. Um, but if you have Google Suite. So Gmail, Google Docs, anything like that then you can build a Bitmoji classroom on a Google slide. You can also build a Bitmoji classroom really on with a PowerPoint or anything like that that has slide presentation software Canva, if you embed the links into the images that you use. We use Google Slides, to build our Bitmoji classrooms, Mainly because it's easier to embed the slide onto a web page without trying to move to different slides, Shawn had to figure that out, that was beyond my brain but I can build the slides and build a Bitmoji classroom, and then you just click on each item. I had backup slides, just in case our internet went down. So if you're building out a Google slide, each one of these are just like a background color, a background floor that I integrated in. And then, every single one of these is just something I copied and pasted in then embedded the URL for whatever resource link it was. And so they're pretty time consuming to build, but they work really well so I recommend if you just literally type in Google Slides Google's gonna take you straight to that platform. There's a few How to videos online, but once you get started you kind of figure out what works, and I like to, because I'm a total Snoop, I like to see the analytics on these, the videos get clicked the most, and then coloring sheets, things like that and even the little bit Moji person, little Bitmoji AMG over here, it has audio embedded in it welcome new, like to the classroom. So my recommendation is Google slides but you can make interactive like Bitmoji rooms using any type of presentation software.

Unknown Speaker 43:02
I'll get off with the gift so that.

Unknown Speaker 43:10
Let's see. Are there any other questions or anyone raising their hand. Okay, Andrea.

Unknown Speaker 43:19
Yeah that's Andrea. Thanks, Angela and and Sean for this presentation. I'm curious, then, about how you work with exhibition developers right to create these resources so can you confirm. When you create a resource for culture hub, does it have to live on smart guide or are you creating resources outside of that system.

Unknown Speaker 43:44
Shawn, do you want to, or you want me to go for it.

Unknown Speaker 43:48
You would start with us.

Unknown Speaker 43:51
Sure. So, that's a good question, and because this is built outside right now it's exhibitions everything's focused on permanent gallery or permanent gallery objects are a collection, we have a lot more freedom and don't need as much. I guess permission. And for the rights to do these. And so, with, if we create it on culture bridge on the website itself, it's also built in house, no permissions are needed. And all of these objects for the most part are from antiquity. We do work with the curator. When we started culture bridge. Our curator of Asian art had retired, and we didn't have a curator for two years but my backgrounds in Asian art so we move forward with the project. Now that we have a curator, we do try to leverage their knowledge and make sure we're not about to put something online that shouldn't go online, or that so sacred that we would devalue the object or the experience in terms of linking what goes on smart guide what goes on smart guide plus, and what goes on culture bridge. You do have to have the most permission to go on culture bridge since the impact is farther and it can be used international anywhere. If you're using something in gallery like smart guide plus you have limited permission because it never leaves the confines of the museum gallery. But I may have taken your question in a different direction, Andrew. So if I didn't answer it let me know and if it was like a more tech side question. Now that

Unknown Speaker 45:35
you answered it I was just curious about like, like, who comes together to create this resource right like does it have to live on smart guide in order to, like, appear on culture bridge right again understand the flow now. Yeah, as a follow up question to that then I'm really curious about how you all are using analytics, I really like the point that you look at what people are responding to to determine what you create. Next, can you talk a little bit more about like what KPIs you actually use to evaluate this and maybe any trends that you saw, of course through 2020 and anything that might have stayed the same through 2021

Unknown Speaker 46:14
I can start with this when we do use Google Analytics, when we set up culture bridge we did try to create hooks for the different types of media so you know someone's playing a video versus taking the quiz. We do try to track the level of engagement with each type of resource. It's still new, so I wouldn't. You know we do have some trends, but again, last year was kind of a weird year. Yeah, I'm not really sure what we know quite yet.

Unknown Speaker 46:53
Yeah, we've gotten so what's interesting so far about culture bridge, because it didn't launch in the middle of a pandemic, which we did on purpose and accelerated the release to help out our educators that we know we're, we're struggling in town, is that this website is also incredibly nice right, it's an educator resource website, which is currently only on Asian art, which means it's only going to fit into certain grade levels. Even though all of our lesson plans align with curriculum. So, going through the analytics, as we've been building out resources. And if I'm just going by Google Analytics, and looking at the trends on on Google, the top used resource varies each month. But what remains in constant upswing. The quick guides that are on the website, which are slightly more educator focus and I'll, I'll go to that very quickly. Um, So, we found out that I built these quick guides just for like a really quick introduction for educators that maybe have a really hard time talking about the complexities of religion with K through 12. And you kind of need to know those heavy hitter points. So, I made just three quick gods, Buddhism, Hinduism and pronunciations and they just kept getting hit after hit, and we're used and accessed, multiple times early on, so I use that to build more quick guides and we have more in the making. We just released this week the life of the Buddha, that's a digital comic book but it serves as a quick guide to the life of the Buddha and Buddhism. And so, analytics helped us realize one to make more quick guides something very fast, that a teacher can use and feel confident, analytics, also showed that when we had a teacher committee that helped us decide what types of resources educators needed. And so, they were like videos videos videos videos, we want different types of videos, and we need to be able to plug and play, play the video in class, and then immediately have a quiz or another activity. And by far the top used videos that we have are the five W's of art series which is the who what when where and why. And so analytics started picking up our top videos, aside from five W's, our meditation videos, so we did some that encouraged slow looking, and also come to class, and once we did one the analytics picked up on the videos through Google Analytics, and the new analytics so we knew we needed to continue doing meditations, which brought us to the Bitmoji rooms, lesson plans are used, and they get a lot of hits, but nothing like the videos and the next step, which is Kwazii surprising, are the coloring sheets. We started with coloring sheets thinking, not necessarily that it will be filler, but just that. It's just something that it's great to use you learn through coloring, but they like the coloring sheets have gone crazy. So Analytics helps us know that it's kind of a pivotal part of a classroom. And these coloring sheets you can download an in color, or you can use, you know, a program online and color digitally. So analytics really helped a lot, a lot with that. And then just kind of guiding between a lot of people were gearing towards the resources on Hinduism. And so I met with a teacher group. And essentially the teacher said, we don't know enough about Hinduism, we're really worried or hesitant to teach about that started in our classrooms and this has enabled us to bring it in because the Museum does the heavy lifting in this part with the quick guides in the videos. So, I always say user feedback is the best feedback but Analytics is a great way to snoop. But like Sean said everything's changing now that we're coming out of the pandemic. And I think analytics are going to change with hybrid classrooms. I can say that culture bridge wasn't used as much over the summer numbers went down, which is also not a school year, and as soon as September hit our analytics, like doubled in the amount of visits to the website and is already starting to grow in October. Oh we got to raise hands. Go ahead.

Unknown Speaker 51:47
Me, I'm doing.

Unknown Speaker 51:49
I have my mouse over it, Jessica.

Unknown Speaker 51:53
Um, well I grew up in Birmingham and I loved the museum I went there all the time as a kid so I just wanted to say that but, um, when I was working at the last Art Museum, I was at. We had a lot of these conversations about like harvesting content that was developed for use in a physical space with clothes looking using it on the web, harvesting audio transcripts for, you know audio guides and using that on the web and there was kind of, I guess it was coming from executive but there was kind of this feeling that we should be thinking of the web as its own kind of unique thing and its own unique audience, and we really shouldn't be creating content that is specific to that that's made for that now, you know, you can't exactly do that on the cheap so that didn't take us very far as those sort of executive top down, order, but I wonder if, when you, if you think that coming out of the pandemic you've, you've proven that there's a return on investment in these in these educational resources in this digital on the web. Do you think that you would pivot to sort of say, create custom content for this platform for this format, or will you continue to harvest the content.

Unknown Speaker 53:05
Oh, we've already started creating stuff specific for this platform that will only exist on this platform that is made just for our digital audience. So, I totally understand like especially your institutions coming from those are all the same conversations we've had in the way that I feel. And I think we knew this before the pandemic, but the pandemic really showed it and Shawn and I have talked about this a million times is that we have now had this opportunity to create an environment that's a completely New Museum, the digital Museum, and that that audience is going to grow on its own, so you're going to have your in person audience, your hybrid audience and your digital audience, and that can only, again, greater impact, benefit you and when you make it with intentionality, I'm intentionally making something just for the digital audience, they know that they're being cared about and they're going to come back again and visit your site. So I, we're gonna, we are investing in it we're gonna continue to make things specifically for this website. We're gonna start adding in other areas of art onto this website and really kind of go full throttle, because I don't think times marching backwards, digital, it's just happening, and you got to meet people, even though the art in our resume is old doesn't mean we have to use antiquated boats of interpretation. Yeah, and

Unknown Speaker 54:34
I was gonna add to that 2020 validated what we have built over the years, which I think, at our institution we came from kind of a very different place and that we were always justifying smart guide and, you know web resources and all of it, so that drastically changed last year because it was our only visitor ship. So it's really what kept our museum and, you know, MANY others, open.

Unknown Speaker 55:07
I know we have about, a little less than 10 minutes left but yeah I'm curious about you guys. Who else had to kind of pivot really quick during the pandemic and put something online just to ensure like, Hey, I'm an educator my job still valid, please don't let me go and also you, in what ways people were reaching out, I think, I've never seen more creativity in such a sweet moment in my life than the pandemic and seeing like the museum hustle and people really reaching out to visitors and ways I've never even thought of it was really inspiring. If anyone has extorted

Unknown Speaker 55:45
educators. Mm hmm, I'm not an educator for instance, so I think Andrea is still not in an educator role. So there's a number of us I wonder who are, like maybe coming at it from systems or web or digital. And we were the conduits for everyone else's pivot, and this is a really interesting use of time this sort of like using the COVID sort of period as a lab to experiment and take the opportunity of it or not having a curator barrier I think was really smart. Just to prove prove the worth of these kinds of things so that you could resource them in future, but I'd be I'd be curious, how MANY of us on this call are actually educators versus

Unknown Speaker 56:31

Unknown Speaker 56:35
Here let's stop here for a second. Anyone want to raise their hand if you are not an educator. That is care, 1234. All right, educators.

Unknown Speaker 56:58
So we have a few.

Unknown Speaker 56:59
Well, I mean, and for our institution Shawn and I from day one, have worked hand in hand. It's the web is for me everything in terms of reach. And so, it seemed like a natural fit. And on the curator side, Lord hammer. Cuz I think everyone has needs and I like can't for everyone I know that works in love and systems, the amount of work you guys have to juggle from every single department at a museum coming to you and saying, Can this go online or can we reformat this honestly it's mind boggling, and I don't. Thank you. We can't do anything without you. Oh my gosh, we would have just gone to the wayside.

Unknown Speaker 57:48
I'm happy to share an anecdote and oh that's helpful and yes as Jessica pointed out, I am also not an educator but think with systems and last year, my institution or former institution I worked really closely with the education team both in like we had a resource have very similar to culture bridge so it meant like rethinking the categories right by which people could search because it wasn't just like a teacher right we added like a for example, a filter for place like I could use this outside, or at home or like on my own to like really help like parents who might be looking at this for the first time, as they go into remote learning with their kids. But the other piece of that was like really supporting virtual programs and I am really thankful for the times that I've been able to work with educators because it's like, oh, I can understand a system of like, this is what's technically possible and this is a really like efficient way to run things but a perfect system has no users, and I'm like, Wait, does this actually make sense to the people who actually need to register for this program. So it was a good like reality check moment but like, working together just made both of our lives easier and the work better for it.

Unknown Speaker 58:58
Shawn, I think she said everything that you had to live through

Unknown Speaker 59:03
all those sounds pretty familiar.

Unknown Speaker 59:06
Let's see, we got five minutes left but I could, in every way, the moment we started doing webinars, and we had like virtual public programs we were trying to family festivals online and Shawn had to figure out some way to register people for art kits but also someone to go online for this live portion of the event, it became this user nightmare slash symphony of like, who's managing what, who's gonna sit in this room, with this group of people. But I love the idea that y'all pivoted to this can be done outside. This can be done. That's Shawn had to redo our whole website to make it just resources that happened during the pandemic and their categories realigned with Shawver very similar in terms of, this is something you play with this is something you want.

Unknown Speaker 1:00:02
Yeah, it was. And, you know, when everything shut down, cultural bridge was nearing completion but not ready yet. So in an ideal world, we would have been able to just send people over to the resource site, but we kind of had to bridge the two and then speed up and see how quickly we can get it live. And then one thing that I thought about I don't know if we listed the URL, the smart guide is art slash guide. If anyone wants to go directly to it.

Unknown Speaker 1:00:39
Yeah, there's an index on it so you can go to RSP slash dive and click index. And it shows everything that's up right now because objects rotate in and out of the galleries. So we have two minutes so this is going to end at some point. And we also had. Oh, I sent the URL to our web manager instead of everyone who's

Unknown Speaker 1:01:10
the artist who's drawing your coloring sheets are you working with someone locally.

Unknown Speaker 1:01:14
Yes, we're working with the illustrator Hannah Adamson. I'm going to type it in. She is amazing. She did all of the illustrations for Lena Dunham instance here's a Mata, and she just happens to be local and worked at the BMA and our kids center for a while. Um, she's always looking for commissions, she also did our life at the Buddha comic book. She's incredible. She's super fun to work with, I highly recommend. Yeah, she's awesome.

Unknown Speaker 1:01:41
Great, really fun. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 1:01:45
we're really happy we needed the Hindu illustrations, really bad to the coloring sheets for that, because all of our objects have like a broken arm or they're missing something and the illustrations help students identify what they're looking for it's and fast. Okay. All right, we have one minute. So thank you everybody so much. Thanks for participating. I really love learning what you guys are doing and talking about it feels good that we're all kind of facing the same questions and problems and and have the same hopes.